Fubar's GT Build

[Fubar]

Here are a couple of pix of the stock pistons.

All of the parts on the GT seems to have cool little markings from the builder. The rods had this white line. The piston head also has a small white dot, just above the pin.

Here's a shot of all the goodies disassembled.

 

[Lorenzo]

I absolutely love those kind of pictures.

 

[Fubar]

I absolutely love those kind of pictures.

Thanks, I feel the same way. I love the technical side of this hobby.

The piston were also labeled according cylinder.


This the pinhole on the rod seemed to be coated with copper or maybe a pressed brass ring? These rods were really lightweight, beautiful piece of equipment. Ford did a great job with these car.

 

[1434gt]

how many miles on the old motor ?or how many hard miles?the rod bearings start to show some marks

 

[cobra498]

I may have missed it and if so I apologize, but am wondering what you are doing to improve engine cooling, it seems marginal at best with any additional power.

 

[Fubar]

The car had 33k miles on it when we pulled the crank. Considering the Texas summers and 800+ whp I think things looked very smooth. The bearings show wear signs that are very tyPical in a Ford mod motor. They would have been fine for another 30k miles, no problem.

We have done a number of things to assist the intercooler and keep exhaust heat out of the engine bay. Motor cooling has not been modified near enough for my tastes. For now I just plan to use lower rpm ranges at the track. I have a project mapped out to improve cooling later but that is at least 9 months and $10k away.

 

[2112]

Mark, What is considered the weak link in the stock rods? I would guess the bolts and not the rods.

Was the discussion ever had to upgrade to CARR bolts and keep the rods or did you change rod lengths too?

 

[Fubar]

We changed compression and were also talking about N2O, at that point the stock rods were just not tested enough to understand their full potential. The rest of the motor is completely overbuilt for 1500hp, leaving the stock rods in their just wasn't part of the thought process.

The "thought process" sounded a lot like... Why half-ass what you can over do? ...Followed by something like "yes order the depleted uranium valves from the Russians, we'll worry government clearance when it gets here. Muwh ha ha ha ha"

Something like that.

Cheers.

 

[cobra498]

Yes... it is a variable orifice... meaning we can control how far open or closed it is. This varies the amount of nitrous being induced. The solenoid also has a "feedback" channel to the computer so that we know where the solenoid valve is.

Cheers

Does it use a stepper motor, if not, how do you vary the opening with a solenoid, different windings for each position or voltage steps?

 

[Fubar]

I figured Shawn would chime in on this but I know he has been at the track (uh, airfield I should say) with a crew, putting a MoTeC on a real Spitfire. I saw a video of this plane doing the its first US flight... such a beautiful plane!

To answer your question Cobra, we are using a relatively new technology that incorporates adjustable orifice. I am not sure exactly who we are buying it from but I know Shawn was pretty excited about the gadget. I believe this Revo is the company site but I am not 100% on it.

 

[cobra498]

I figured Shawn would chime in on this but I know he has been at the track (uh, airfield I should say) with a crew, putting a MoTeC on a real Spitfire. I saw a video of this plane doing the its first US flight... such a beautiful plane!

To answer your question Cobra, we are using a relatively new technology that incorporates adjustable orifice. I am not sure exactly who we are buying it from but I know Shawn was pretty excited about the gadget. I believe this Revo is the company site but I am not 100% on it.

Thank You, I was just curious, hard to tell, but it appears to be a motor driven valve so that you could have infinite variability on nitrous delivery. I wonder what the cycle time is, probably very quick because it has to be.

 

[MoTeC Magic]

Hi Guys,

I was away for a little while with the airplane guys. Such a cool plane to put a MoTeC on, all the piston planes I have seen, fueling is all over the place… really nails that issue down.

Anyway…

Very nice clutch. Whats the carbon disc material like to machine..

The carbon machines easily… it does wear tools slightly quicker, however, the biggest issues is carbon dust (not good for machines). We machined them dry with a vacuum strapped to the head to collect as much dust as possible. A good wash down of the machine afterwards to get the rest.


Cheers

 

[MoTeC Magic]

Thank You, I was just curious, hard to tell, but it appears to be a motor driven valve so that you could have infinite variability on nitrous delivery. I wonder what the cycle time is, probably very quick because it has to be.

One of the issues with nitrous is being able to vary the amount injected into the motor and maintain even distribution. Thus far the solution has been to pulse it. You can imagine if running a larger shot of nitrous that the opening and closing of the pulsations would not evenly match up to intake events of all the cylinders. You can see would result in uneven distribution between cylinders and uneven power pulses. Think of it like 300hp on 300hp off.

The REVO is a servo driven variable orifice. It is a ball valve that can be rotated to open to just about any position. This allows the amount delivered to the motor to be varied and since it is an orifice that is always open... flow is distributed to the cylinders as evenly as the air is.

I started working with WON because they had the quickest / highest cycling solenoid for pulsing. I needed it for a class that only allowed one solenoid, a drag bike that we run about 400hp shot on. If you have to pulse it, the faster you pulse it the better.

Over time they developed a variable ball valve for nitrous delivery. It started as an analog driven valve and is now a digitally driven valve. I and a few of the top MoTeC guys in the US have been pushing them to develop a control that will work directly via the MoTeC. He as finished the prototype, I'm supposed to be getting digital proto #2 and #3 sometime next month for the drag bike and for Mark's mousy little hp build

They have also added a feedback sensor to provide valve position to the MoTeC for fueling... this improves our fuel delivery since we run a dry shot with the extra fuel provided through the injectors by the MoTeC.

These are the future of nitrous delivery… substantially better than traditional solenoids.

Cheers

 

[BlackICE]

Sounds like a very nice setup. :thumbsup

 

[MoTeC Magic]

Hi Guys,
A quick update on Mark's build

We got the CNC program written and the intake modifications machined. These modifications do two main things.

First:
We removed the front engine coolant ports where the water from the heads passes through the intake manifold. This is to make room for the new billet water necks that bypass the hotwater to prevent it from going through the intake. We also clearanced the intake for the rear water ports we are adding. As most of you remember, there are phenolic spacers with o-ring grooves that go between the head and the intake now. Isolating the intake from the conductive head of the head by way of the phenolic spacer and eliminating the hot water that passes through the intake... we've dramatically reduced the amount of heat that the intake would be subjected to. This in effect, will substantially reduce intake temperature increasing power potential and reducing detonation potential.

Second:
We relieved the outer portion of the injector pocket... the clearance provides room for the 2000cc injectors to be installed into the injector pockets.

The GT as many of you know, has a non-conventional seal at the base of the injector. I personally think they are a poor design and do more harm than good, especially in regard to blocking airflow since the port has such large bosses to accommodate them. It is possible to remedy this though it would be a lot of work, we opted not to do so. Because there is not a traditional oring seal at the base, and because the injector sits so low in this pocket... we had to clearance the outside lip because the injector terminal for the 2000cc injectors sit so much lower than the 1000cc injectors or the stock injectors.

These 2000cc injectors are for a GT in Houston that is going to be running straight methanol with one of our mechanical systems... We wanted to go ahead and clearance Mark's so that if we wanted to go to Methanol for track events in the future with his GT, we wouldn't have to pull everything apart again and do this mod.

Cheers


Here are 3 reminder photos of the CAD model of the water necks and o-ring phenolic spacers

Here are some of the pieces... the closest set of billet rails are Mark's... currently it has the 1000cc injectors installed in them. His rails are Hard anodized on the inside to protect the aluminum from alcohol based fuels and then a standard type 2 clear anodizing on the outside so that they look like machined aluminum but have protection from oxidation.

The 2000cc injecotors are on the tray, one is assembled, the 15 other are sill apart.

The rails at the far end are for the Methanol GT in Houston, they are hard black anodized on the inside and bare on the outside. We'll be polishing the ouside for them and then machining the logo. We may or may not do a clear ceramic over them afterwards.

Keep in mind the intake is dirty, and hasn't been cleaned up since coming off the car or machining... it will have all sharp edges debured and sanded... it will then be hit with a scotch brite wheel to lightly polish it all up and smooth it out good. These are not finished images.... you're getting them in the middle of the modification right after machining.

2000cc injector on the left, 1000cc injector on the right (1000cc injector is much like the overall shape of the stock injector)

Checking fitment of rail assembly... 2000cc injectors... stock fuel pressure sensor installed for test fit as well

 

[Fubar]

Thanks Fish, can't wait to see the new 4.5L Whipple on there (are you listening Dustin?).

Shawn also had a few great ideas to deal with cooling that should be a huge improvement over stock. I am going to tease you with that until the system is properly tested. But for those who like to track the GT and have always envied the cool running ability of a turbo motor... your going to like this It is potentially a big improvement with no foreseeable downside. OooOOoOooooOooooo

 

[STORMCAT]

Thanks Fish, can't wait to see the new 4.5L Whipple on there (are you listening Dustin?).

Shawn also had a few great ideas to deal with cooling that should be a huge improvement over stock. I am going to tease you with that until the system is properly tested. But for those who like to track the GT and have always envied the cool running ability of a turbo motor... your going to like this It is potentially a big improvement with no foreseeable downside. OooOOoOooooOooooo

Mark, Keep us posted on the Cooling improvments.. I might be interested in the Clutch as well. Maybe you can do a group offer and spread out the Mfg costs ?? Thanks for all the updates and photos !!

 

[Fubar]

I didn't think the cranks on the GTs were balanced but these drillings appear to suggest otherwise. Thoughts?

 

[ChipBeck]

......the closest set of billet rails are Mark's.....currently it has the 1000cc injectors installed in them. His rails are hard anodized on the inside to protect the aluminum from alcohol based fuels and then a standard type 2 clear anodizing on the outside so that they look like machined aluminum but have protection from oxidation. The rails at the far end are for the Methanol GT in Houston......

And the 3rd set is going on my GT. :biggrin

Chip

 

[fjpikul]

Mice?