My first and only car with paddle shifters was a 2003 M3 with BMW's first attempt at paddle shifters, I could not get rid of the car fast enough!! I realize they have improved, still have not owned a car without the "third peddle " since. There seems to be 2 types; one the paddles are fixed and the other rotate with the wheel. Any comments which type the NFGT will have, any driving habits in general with them!
Paddle Shifting
- Thread starter Gene Cassone
- Start date
cobra498
GT Owner
I am not sure about paddle location fixed or rotating but I would not own a car with a conventional manual transmission now. My 991 GT3 has spoiled me forever, it shifts so perfectly up and down, never misses a gear and launches like a space shuttle. I have owned and driven some very nice manuals that were dog ring synchronized and could be easily shifted with out using the clutch for anything other than starts but they pale in comparison. I would not trade any of them for the PDK, it will always be faster than any manual and eliminates the occasional mistake that invariably happens when shifting a manual in the heat of battle. I can understand that enthusiasts want the experience of being "part of the process" but screw that if it is slower, and it is.
PeteK
GT Owner
I know the double-clutch computer-driven tranny is faster than a human with a traditional manual ever can be, but I've spent a lifetime perfecting my clutch and heel-and-toe techniques and it gives me pleasure to execute those tasks smoothly and quickly. I enjoy resting my hand on the shift knob, anticipating the next gear change and minuet on the pedals, unwinding the steering wheel to run to the outside edge of the road as I head down the straight ahead of me.
Since self-driving cars are now possible, I'm also sure that several manufacturers are working on software that can read and optimize the racing line through every turn on every racetrack, so that the "driver" only intervenes to direct tactics when dicing with other cars. Then the human driver becomes the tactician/navigator/copilot/passenger. I trust you will also enthusiastically adopt that technology too because it's faster than you.
Me? Nah, I'll stick with analog cars for the same reason I'll stick with analog sex--it's not about being fast and efficient, it's about enjoying the tactile experience.
Since self-driving cars are now possible, I'm also sure that several manufacturers are working on software that can read and optimize the racing line through every turn on every racetrack, so that the "driver" only intervenes to direct tactics when dicing with other cars. Then the human driver becomes the tactician/navigator/copilot/passenger. I trust you will also enthusiastically adopt that technology too because it's faster than you.
Me? Nah, I'll stick with analog cars for the same reason I'll stick with analog sex--it's not about being fast and efficient, it's about enjoying the tactile experience.
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The F-Type R I drove over the weekend had the Bronze paddle shifter turning with the steering wheel, and I prefer that vs. the stationary to the column ones, particularly when making turns. And oh boy, this thing burbles like Disneyland fire works (press the gas and let go, or down shift 2 or 3 shifts). I have no clue how the N-FGT paddle shifters are configured.
The Doppelkupplung (leave it to the Germans to come up with that name :biggrin) is nice and precise and faster than any mortal shifting, but not as engaging as the manual tranny particularly if you're good at heel/toe shifting.
The Doppelkupplung (leave it to the Germans to come up with that name :biggrin) is nice and precise and faster than any mortal shifting, but not as engaging as the manual tranny particularly if you're good at heel/toe shifting.
Apollo
GT Owner
Agree 200%. It is not just a matter of being faster shifting, it is just so perfect for every application from stop and go traffic, to the most intense track day you could want. I completely understand the old school thought of a manual. but once I really used a good DCT/sequential,(not slushbox paddle like Corvette or jaguar..) there really is no comparison. My opinion - it is far more fun in any situation for me than a manual.
BTW, the NFGT did it right with the paddles part of the steering wheel and rotate with your hands to give you the perfect position without removing your hand from wheel to execute the shift. Even the GTR has switched to this configuration on their latest model. The right way to do it is to have the paddles rotate as part of the steering wheel. It is the most efficient for performance driving.
Another great thing about DCT/sequential transmissions -they have so many personalities that you can choose the type of car you prefer at a moments notice. You can totally sit back and let it do all the work, and it will perform near flawless. Or you can be as engaged as you want. Full throttle upshifts or hard downshifts mid corner, which I submit are far more exciting and more thrills than being frustrated waiting in a turn in a gear waiting for the right time to balance the car for a heel toe shift. You can choose so many configurations on how it works, hold gears until rev limit, up or down, you will never be bored if you use it as you do a manual. Also, you will never take the chance of damaging your baby with a missed downshift requiring a complete engine rebuild and many times also includes body damage because it sent your baby into a barrier. Drive it hard or soft and you pick the personality you want. change your mind in an instant, either because you want to or you got yourself over your head, you can choose to switch back and forth without you even having to think about it. It will do anything a manual will do and you also can choose whether it will save you or not, and it will do it just like any manual, only better. It will bang shifts with a snap and chirp, or it will shift smoother than a Lincoln Towncar, doing everything a great automatic will do, only better. Looking for something for your left foot to do? try left foot braking. It will keep you from ever thinking you will be bored from not using a clutch, I promise... They are really ideal for the daily driver to the ultimate enthusiast. To me, the only reason I will choose a manual is because there isn't a DCT option.
Can you tell I really like them? :biggrin
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Howard
GT Owner
All my cars are manuals. I spec'd out a Cayman GTS last year with a manual, and I love it. However, I just spent two weeks in Europe touring in a 2017 Carrera 4S with PDK. As Apollo said, you can choose the PDK's personality between Normal, Sport and Sport +. The differences are significant and useful. You are never in the wrong gear, particularly important in a turbocharged car like the new 911 (they are now ALL turbo'd) and the N-FGT. I detected no turbo lag. If I had the opportunity to spec out my GTS again......I really don't know what I'd do.
Howard
Howard
texas mongrel
GT Owner
McLarens use a rocker rather than individual paddles, pull the right side to shift up, left side to shift down. It rotates with the wheel too, which IMO is much better than the ones that are fixed. Early Macs also had pre-cog which, when you pulled halfway on the paddle, it spooled up the next gear so that when you completed the pull it was instantaneous.. this feature was discontinued in late 2013. Gearsticks are fun but the quickest way around a track is by paddles, and the most livable way of driving on the street is paddles. RIP manual gearboxes
Thanks for feedback! Who is making the unit for NFGT? Reliability history? I heard maintenance can be quite costly?
beckertb
GT Owner
The debate of manual vs paddle shift will not end for another 50 years or so when there are NO more manual transmission cars to be found or anyone who can drive them but as Pete said, I really ENJOY driving a manual transmission car. Last paddle shift street car I had was 13 458 and I have no doubt it could shift more quickly and reliably than I could ever but I got rid of the car within a few months because of the lack of enjoyment in driving it. I agree whole heartedly that on my race cars I have to have paddle shifters to be competitive but on street cars, its about the enjoyment and for me, the manual transmision has no substitute.
Awsum GT
GT Owner '18
My Mercedes AMG GTs has paddle shifters that turn with the steering wheel. You have a choice between normal, sport, sport + and race. The sport + and the race mode changes the ride and exhaust note. I prefer the race mode. You are able to choose when to shift the car and it will automatically down shift as the car slows. The feel and shift is very responsive and quick. I think I heard that the GT will have the paddle shifters that are stationary. Not 100% sure though.
I drove a Ferrari Enzo for around 30-40 minutes in Las Vegas a few weeks ago. I must say I was not impressed with the way the car's paddle shifting responded. There seemed to be a lag after shifting the gears. The car is beautiful though.
I drove a Ferrari Enzo for around 30-40 minutes in Las Vegas a few weeks ago. I must say I was not impressed with the way the car's paddle shifting responded. There seemed to be a lag after shifting the gears. The car is beautiful though.
The debate will never end but I prefer a manual tranny for sports cars driven on the road. My commuter car is an auto & if I had another race car I would choose a paddle shifter.
Ed
PS I'm not sure if any info is out on the type of paddle shifters on the NGT.
Ed
PS I'm not sure if any info is out on the type of paddle shifters on the NGT.
GKW05GT
GT Owner
Awsum GT
GT Owner '18
hard to tell if the paddles are fixed... DBK... do you have any idea? Can't believe this is secret info at this point?
33Bravo
GT Owner
I could not have said it better. I too just like driving 3 pedal cars. There is nothing like having some people crowd around your fancy car, and the feeling you get when you stall.
No question - paddle shifters are faster around a track. Personal preference here but I look at all the available high end cars and acknowledge I'm definitely in the minority.
RPM217
2005 white/blue stripe
BAT
GT Owner
I am all for paddle shifters but it DOES increase the chances of my wife driving it by about 75%. Not sure how I feel about that. :biggrin
GT transmission is a 7-speed Getrag dual clutch. Presumably a variant of the 7DCL750 unit in the 458/488/LaFerrari. I've always liked the character of that transmission when driven hard. It is probably a little too smooth for me. The alternative is having silly artificial "banging" calibrated in like Lamborghini does with the otherwise excellent LDF in the Huracan in Corsa mode (which is absent in the R8 version). PDK in a GT3 is just about perfect to me. The needle doesn't sweep, it just appears elsewhere on the dial immediately. Very smooth at part throttle and like a bomb goes off at WOT.
Just having paddles doesn't mean anything. Manufacturers put paddles on everything, including shitty hydraulic automatic transmissions. The old robotized manual gearboxes like Lambo's E-gear are absolute garbage compared to today's DCTs.
These cars are so fast now that the manual is a distraction to me. I would certainly agree that tooling around with a DCT is less engaging than tooling around with a manual transmission, but I've never really bought the "engagement" thing if you're actually driving hard. Go drive a 458 hard through the mountains and tell me you don't feel like Michael Schumacher when you get out...
Just having paddles doesn't mean anything. Manufacturers put paddles on everything, including shitty hydraulic automatic transmissions. The old robotized manual gearboxes like Lambo's E-gear are absolute garbage compared to today's DCTs.
These cars are so fast now that the manual is a distraction to me. I would certainly agree that tooling around with a DCT is less engaging than tooling around with a manual transmission, but I've never really bought the "engagement" thing if you're actually driving hard. Go drive a 458 hard through the mountains and tell me you don't feel like Michael Schumacher when you get out...
