BJ discussion


red gt 1442

GT Owner
Mark IV Lifetime
Dec 23, 2005
754
NY Metro Area
I don't personally, but paid attention through the years. Dad was going back and forth with him trying to buy KK 2526 from him in 2000. He was asking 125K for it back then, and my old man had a hard time justifying that kind of price. Steve Strange wound up buying it just before he was going to pull the trigger :frown

Supposedly it was built for Bunkie K, then he got fired from Ford mid year. IIRC car is still on the MSO, <900 miles, original oil drained blah blah blah. To sum up: Ed is a real nice guy and his B9 knowledge is probably second to none...and procrastination can cost much more than face value.

Anyways, this is why 2526 is "special" :lol:

PICT0293.jpg


2526:

KK2526.jpg

That my friend is a very special collection of consecutive cars. Ed Meyer has always told me that having consecutive number cars is probably the hardest possibility of a car collection....even tough his collection has a few consecutive numbered 70 Shelby's Concertibles....Sorry you didn;t buy KK2526.....would of been in great company for sure.....also considering the rare Grabber Orange color which I believe was 1 of 9 .............
 

B O N Y

MODERATOR & FGT OWNER
Mark IV Lifetime
Sep 5, 2005
12,110
Fresno, Ca.

Lousy deal for the seller of the tankers, he had $600k in there.
 

KMCBOSS

RED GT owner
Mark II Lifetime
Dec 3, 2006
995
Bremerton, Washington
That my friend is a very special collection of consecutive cars. Ed Meyer has always told me that having consecutive number cars is probably the hardest possibility of a car collection....even tough his collection has a few consecutive numbered 70 Shelby's Concertibles....Sorry you didn;t buy KK2526.....would of been in great company for sure.....also considering the rare Grabber Orange color which I believe was 1 of 9 .............

They made 68 grabber orange 1970 BOSS 429s - just sold one (KK2372) to buy the GT.
 

50 BMG

Well-known member
Aug 3, 2005
559
AZ
They made 68 grabber orange 1970 BOSS 429s - just sold one (KK2372) to buy the GT.

Wouldn't happen to have a orange boss 302 would ya? :wink
 

06VistaBlueGT

Well-known member
Aug 30, 2006
132
What other cars does Ron Pratte have in his collection, other than the Super Snake and the Futureliner?

He bought the last 67 Sting Ray this year ($600K), and also bought the lowest VIN Ford GT at last years Palm Beach auction ($530K). It was VIN #3, a 2005 QuickSilver/Black stripe coupe. Also bought the 1st customer GT500 last year at B-J AZ($600K), the 1st customer Shelby GT this year ($600K), also got the Pontiac Bonneville Special (the green concept) last year ($2.8M)to GO WITH the Futureliner. Picked up the Chrysler D'Elegance Concept for over a $1 Million last year. These are the cars that I know about. His list of cars is endless. Like the fellow mentioned, that episode of Beyond the Block, showed the insides of his collection. AMAZING THINGS!!!

Note, the $$$ above are W/O the buyers premium.
 

KMCBOSS

RED GT owner
Mark II Lifetime
Dec 3, 2006
995
Bremerton, Washington
Wouldn't happen to have a orange boss 302 would ya? :wink


Yep - here is a link to my BOSS 302 web site. Ed

http://hometown.aol.com/boss494/myhomepage/index.html
 
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Shelby#18

GTX1 Owner/Moderator
Mark IV Lifetime
Le Mans 2010 Supporter
Dec 15, 2006
1,623
Nev./So. Cal./Minn.
Was the #001 GTX1 there?
 

cobrajeff

GT Owner
Mark IV Lifetime
Feb 5, 2006
688
Daytona Beach
Gtx1 @ Bj

The first production GTX1 did not make it to Scottsdale. There were two press releases about it on B-J's website, one (dated 4/1/06) saying it would be at Scottsdale, and another (dated 3/22/06) saying it would be offered at Palm Beach, Florida - guess Palm Beach won out.

Mark and Yogi had the Tungsten "door car" and the Valencia Orange prototype GTX1 roadster there. Unfortunately, it rained off and on Friday through Sunday, and the cars were on display outside without a tent, so the beautiful GTX1 was hiding under a car cover most of the weekend.

Got a chance to say "Hello" to Mark, but not much more. It was a busy week - sure was expecting much nicer weather.

cobrajeff
 

Fast Freddy

GPS'D 225 MPH
Mark II Lifetime
Aug 5, 2005
2,727
Avondale, Arizona
Aj, All I noticed was they had a different ride height thus making them Resto Mods or did I miss something? That Copo Camaro wasnt a bad deal either.

i walked up to the owner on saturday and asked him why the cars were sitting up so high in the front because i knew that that was not factory correct. he said he altered the springs to achieve "the look" that he prefers. :frown personally i think that that look looks like crap :thumbsdow makes you wonder what else he altered :confused
 

04mach1

Well-known member
Jan 2, 2007
214
Small town ohio
i walked up to the owner on saturday and asked him why the cars were sitting up so high in the front because i knew that that was not factory correct. he said he altered the springs to achieve "the look" that he prefers. :frown personally i think that that look looks like crap :thumbsdow makes you wonder what else he altered :confused

Thanks for that! So the stance was bad on the cars? Too high or to low?
 

Yogi

Photographer
Aug 28, 2006
117
Green Bay, WI
The first production GTX1 did not make it to Scottsdale. There were two press releases about it on B-J's website, one (dated 4/1/06) saying it would be at Scottsdale, and another (dated 3/22/06) saying it would be offered at Palm Beach, Florida - guess Palm Beach won out.

Mark and Yogi had the Tungsten "door car" and the Valencia Orange prototype GTX1 roadster there. Unfortunately, it rained off and on Friday through Sunday, and the cars were on display outside without a tent, so the beautiful GTX1 was hiding under a car cover most of the weekend.

Got a chance to say "Hello" to Mark, but not much more. It was a busy week - sure was expecting much nicer weather.

cobrajeff

Yeah, the rain sure was not expected in the desert. That was our #001 production car. We painted it Valencia Orange as a tribute to the prototype car. Sorry we weren't more clear about that. I don't know why it didn't sell at the Scottsdale auction. We are hoping to have her sold at Palm Beach, I will keep you all in the loop on that.
 

cobrajeff

GT Owner
Mark IV Lifetime
Feb 5, 2006
688
Daytona Beach
Thanks for the clarification, Yogi. I left my golf cart parked near your cars a couple times, hoping I'd catch up with you guys, but it seemed like the rain just wouldn't let up.

At least I have the cold and sore throat to prove I was there slogging around in the mud.....

Jeff
 

TEXAS GT

2006 Twin Turbo
Mark IV Lifetime
Le Mans 2010 Supporter
Makes me glad I skipped it this year. A lot of those cars had never seen rain before but they definitely got a dose this year.
 

Gruntled

GT Owner
Dec 11, 2005
203
Get a load of this slam:

http://fourwheeldrift.wordpress.com/

Barrett-Jackson’s Westworld Tents Turn-out to be a House of Cards

January 27th, 2007 by fourwheeldrift

As a collector car journalist, I have been watching the Barrett-Jackson auction for years. For the last five or so years, it has been very apparent that the Scottsdale auction is at best a bastion of greed and manipulation…and at worse, all-out fraud.

I’ve discussed B-J with collectors, dealers and enthusiasts, many of whom would be considered “insiders,” meaning they’ve bought and sold cars at B-J and other auctions, or are well-known in the collector car hobby. For some reason, it is this year that people are all finally grumbling and passing rumors in unison.

The bottom line is that Craig Jackson and the B-J company have really screwed themselves this year. Their contracts specifically promise every car three minutes on the stand. Due to ego and greed, they expanded the Scottsdale ’07 auction to the point they could not provide this, plus they had the audacity to do it on live television.

A well-known former head judge in the Ford Thunderbird circles was one of the sellers who had his car short-timed. He has already filed a law suit against B-J, and this is already headed towards class-action status.

According to this judge and other sources, it appears Barrett-Jackson was operating a bit on the same level as an evangelical healing show. They had assistants milling around asking what specific sellers thought their cars would bring. Armed with this information at the control desk, if a lot passed the value at which a seller indicated he’d be happy, the car would be rushed off and the gavel would fall – even if bidding was still very much alive.

Because the event was televised on live television via the Speed TV network, the plaintiff(s) now have video/audio proof that buyers were signaling increased bids before the three-minute marks, but were denied by a too-fast last call and hammer.

While this all might cause Barrett-Jackson to have to pay money to sellers in the form of a judgment or settlement, it is something else that might land Craig Jackson in jail.

It is no secret that Barrett-Jackson owns many cars that are run through the auction – it was something I suspected many, many years ago. This was proven when they started maintaining a showroom of cars in Arizona. This is not illegal, but stay with me.

I’ve always suspected that the cars owned by Craig Jackson and the B-J company were often driven up by shill bidders working for the company. Essentially, the strategy works in the sense that ever since the auction focus moved from classics like Packards and Duesenbergs to muscle cars, B-J has been able to shill, say a Hemi Cuda or mid-year Corvette 427 they own, which causes the value of the 10 other identical cars to increase. They wind up “buying” their own car back, but the others go on to regular buyers, who now are paying higher because of the perception the market has moved up.

This suspicion has been validated by auction attendees this year that witnessed cars sold at auction headed in trailers back to B-J’s warehouse. The lawsuit allegedly points out that these cars also spent significantly more time on the block than others.

If this isn’t all interesting enough, during this year’s auction, fellow collector car journalist, Keith Martin of Sports Car Market, was booted from the Westworld premises and his media credentials revoked for voicing loud, specific concern regarding the event while sitting in the media room. Barrett-Jackson accused Keith Martin of “holding court” and attempting to send VIPs and journalists to the competing RM and Russo and Steele auction events. Among the alleged opinions included that the cars at B-J were of inferior quality (and had quality misrepresented,) as well as that the bidders were significantly over-bidding cars, which shouldn’t come as a surprise to anyone who has witnessed people paying six figures for cars they could have bought for under $50,000 any other day of the year!!!

This is somewhat of an interesting twist. Keith Martin’s publication has marketed the B-J events and has helped fuel its popularity. Keith is definitely one of the great “insiders” of the hobby, and has been a friend to Craig Jackson. In past years, Keith nor his publication have been critical of the goings-on and rumors, while other collector car journalists have been outwardly screaming that something stunk.
It makes sense, since Sports Car Market really only tracks the value of vehicles and other items sold at auction, rather than via private sales (which really has skewed SCM’s values for years!) So without kissing-ass to B-J, Keith would have missed insider info on the largest events covered by his mag. So we can only guess that Keith and Craig had a falling out of some type.

I applaud Keith for turning the corner on his view of B-J, but I’m with others I’ve talked to about this: I hate to say this about a colleague, but I felt his behavior was a bit unprofessional. As journalists, it is our responsibility to write what we think, but going to the show for years, then promoting RM and Russo+Steele while at Westworld is somewhat unprofessional. I agree that Keith, a true hobbyist who started out by writing an Alfa Romeo newsletter, was for a long time too much a part of the “circus” about which he finally rejected, and that SCM has to a significant degree helped to fuel misinformation and a house of cards regarding specific auction prices and bidding behavior. Keith, by all accounts, is a really good guy — an enthusiast, who maybe just needed to take a step back and a big breath and reacquaint himself with those outside of the very insulated collector car “in crowd” — and spend time with some car people who are not trying to exploit the collectors. There are plenty of guys who have dug themselves too deep into this little crowd, and are no longer fun to deal with, because they’ve put personal greed well ahead of the cars and the collectors. Keith will rebound — he has a great internal staff of really fantastic people, who hopefully will help him return to his roots.

That being said… While I’ve never met him, the buzz among those in the hobby — both collectors and journalists, is that Craig Jackson is quite arrogant, so don’t expect many to come to his rescue. He inherited his father’s company, and has fueled B-J’s growth with a combination of intelligence, drive, ego, and greed. While there is nothing wrong with that combination, when it results in unethical and possibly illegal activities, that’s inexcusable.

Like many surrounding the hobby, I will be watching the events unfold. Will the Westworld tents come down like a house of cards, or will everything just go away with an exchange of a little money? It’s hard to predict. Craig Jackson has become a very powerful man, and his company has pumped billions of dollars into the Arizona economy over the years.

This all being said, there’s no doubt that Barrett-Jackson “jumped the shark” this year. Unlike when Fonzi did it, Craig Jackson drove his allegedly shill-bid Hemicudas over the tank and down a ramp that could lead to six years in a minimum security prison-issued orange jumpsuit. If that’s the case, maybe he can get Sports Car Market in the slammer to keep-up on Russo and Steele, RM and Kruse auction results.
 

BigsGT

Tungsten GT Owner
Mark IV Lifetime
Le Mans 2010 Supporter
Mar 8, 2006
604
Austin Texas
Very interesting. You could sure tell the increase in speed this year as they hustled cars across the stage. Always wondered about the shill activity.
 
Aug 25, 2006
4,436
All I can say is that "if this is true" then it is yet another sad day for those of use that truly enjoy the gals and those folks that create their business around them.

Shadowman
 

201MPH

Member
Apr 25, 2006
19
Toronto
The shill bidding rumors were all over the auction this year, surprised its been as quiet as this up until now. Has SPEED even shown any re-runs of the auction yet?
 

B O N Y

MODERATOR & FGT OWNER
Mark IV Lifetime
Sep 5, 2005
12,110
Fresno, Ca.
Well the fur is flying. As someone who has been published for years doing auction-market reviews in SCM, Hemmings, Car Collector, Victory Lane, Muscle Machines and others I have been waiting for this explosion to occur.

What amazes me, especially with the famous houses like Christies, Bonhams and sell art and fine collectibles is that they vet the goods to determine to veracity of the consignors representation. This does not occur with automobiles, so many of the American cars are counterfeits.

Sit back, pour a cold one, lets watch this thing unravel, there will be many victims, some of them will be the buyers.

here is what the boys over at FChat have going...
http://ferrarichat.com/forum/showthread.php?t=135825&highlight=barrett
 
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lamboman

GT Owner
Mark IV Lifetime
Jun 14, 2006
248
Atlanta area
Sit back, pour a cold one, lets watch this thing unravel, there will be many victims, some of them will be the buyers.

I do believe that statement could read...MOST OF THEM WILL BE THE BUYERS.
 

B O N Y

MODERATOR & FGT OWNER
Mark IV Lifetime
Sep 5, 2005
12,110
Fresno, Ca.
I do believe that statement could read...MOST OF THEM WILL BE THE BUYERS.

This year the list of consignors that left with much less than market price is a long one.... granted, the quality of the cars this year was below previous years.