What will you gain with just a "TUNE"?

[abolfaz]

I was at the dealer again (don't ask) to drop my car off and I was told that they can "tune" the car and give you better HP, MPG and cooler engine temps all without voiding the warranty. With that in mind, has anybody done this? If so what exactly were your gains?

 

[BlackICE]

It is interesting that a dealer can flash your PCM to non-factory specs and it will be still covered under warrantee, whereas if you did that same thing, it may void your warrantee.

bty, what is your car in the shop for? I hope that the bolt issues aren't it.

BlackICE

 

[abolfaz]

bty, what is your car in the shop for? I hope that the bolt issues aren't it.

BlackICE

I'm going to keep my mouth shut until this visit is over. The outcome will determine what I do with the car...

 

[nota4re]

I was told that they can "tune" the car and give you better HP, MPG and cooler engine temps all without voiding the warranty.

Well, I'd be really skeptical that there's a lot to be gained without changing boost pressure. Allegedly, the GT runs a little on the rich side (in open loop), but rest assured Ford has it right where they want it. That said, I suppose a little can be gained from being a little more aggressive on mixture and perhaps a little bit on timing. But both could be at the expense of reducing the safety margin. Also, this kind of tuning is best done on a dyno where you can actually insure you're getting the results you anticipate. There's not many dealers that I know of that have a dyno.

Regarding improved mpg..... I'm stumped. (Although admittedly this happens a lot.) When you're not in the go-pedal, the car is running closed-loop and exactly stoichiometric (14.7:1). Hard to improve on this.... and pretty much impossible to ask the ECU to do anything else.

Cooler engine temps.... OK, I'm stumped again. I guess you can fiddle with toggling the fans on sooner (this is possible within the ECU), but I doubt whether this will be a significant benefit.

My $.02 on the topic.

 

[EasyEric]

According to Kenne Bell on their website, http://www.kennebell.net/superchargers/ford/Ford_GT/Ford_GT.htm you can gain 37hp and 49ft-lbs with their Flash Tune kit. I believe the price is $399.

If true and if it is safe, this is the most cost effective power modification you can make.

Has anyone tried the Kenne Bell Flash Tune yet? If so, what can you say about the difference and the drivability?

Eric

 

[barondw]

I was at the dealer again (don't ask) to drop my car off and I was told that they can "tune" the car and give you better HP, MPG and cooler engine temps all without voiding the warranty. With that in mind, has anybody done this? If so what exactly were your gains?

I don't think it will create cooler operating temps. The problem is still heat sink and the stock muffler blocking air from exiting the engine compartment.

Dave

 

[barondw]

It is interesting that a dealer can flash your PCM to non-factory specs and it will be still covered under warrantee, whereas if you did that same thing, it may void your warrantee.

bty, what is your car in the shop for? I hope that the bolt issues aren't it.

BlackICE

A dealer can do what they want and claim the car is stock when they submit a warranty claim. Also the best re-flashes/tunes allow the program to be removed without a trace for servicing and then re-installed.

Dave

 

[CHAD]

The dealer is the warranty gatekeeper. They will ultimately warrant whatever they want. I'm sure many warrant pullied cars. A pulley and tune are a great bang for the buck mod, especially if your service writer will look the other way.

A tune can make a car run cooler by increasing timing. This is also where a good bit of the power comes from. The rest is fixing the UNBELIEVABLY rich tune.

I think people make way too big a deal out of the muffler and heat. These cars don't run real cool when sitting still but moving seem to do just fine while being flogged. The supercharger is the biggest loser with heat since once it gets heatsoaked the power comes way down.

 

[TrackDay]

As Dave already pointed I too am not one that believes a tune will reduce GT temps (quite the opposite).
Yes, our cars are rich in fuel (as are most production cars) for several reasons one that most are not aware of is it helps preserve the Cats over time. This is a very costly item for a manufacturer to replace under warrantee. So you can imagine their desire not to stress / burn out the cats. As with most “tunes” one can reduce the fuel and you will slightly increase the EGT / heat (Exhaust Temp Gas), add timing and gain some HP and Torque you will also increase the heat output. Simple thermodynamics will say more power more heat is generated. Our cars are already a bit stressed to dissipate the under hood heat due to the placement and physical size of our muffler.
Do what you will with a tune but until someone shows me lower intake temperatures and lower engine temperatures with a stock exhaust system I’m real skeptical.
On the other hand two guys here have already reported back that the Ida Automotive system has delivered on the goods by reducing temperatures and producing more HP.
Just a tune is not the way I would recommend going. I suggest your money is better spent on covering known issues like the under hood (heat sink) temperatures and the overheating Trans-Ax.

 

[ETW]

Do any of you know how much rwhp something like that KB tuner would add? Would it really be 37hp and 49lb ft as advertised?

 

[barondw]

I think people make way too big a deal out of the muffler and heat. These cars don't run real cool when sitting still but moving seem to do just fine while being flogged. The supercharger is the biggest loser with heat since once it gets heatsoaked the power comes way down.

Chad

Use a pyrometer and you will be amazed as to how much heat is in the muffler and trapped in the engine compartment. Yes the supercharger gets hot but I believe you are vastly underestimating the negative impact of the muffler and lack of real air flow.

Dave

 

[saber]

The dealer is the warranty gatekeeper. They will ultimately warrant whatever they want. I'm sure many warrant pullied cars. A pulley and tune are a great bang for the buck mod, especially if your service writer will look the other way.

A tune can make a car run cooler by increasing timing. This is also where a good bit of the power comes from. The rest is fixing the UNBELIEVABLY rich tune.

I think people make way too big a deal out of the muffler and heat. These cars don't run real cool when sitting still but moving seem to do just fine while being flogged. The supercharger is the biggest loser with heat since once it gets heatsoaked the power comes way down.

CHAD,
I am running a consistent 20 degrees cooler with the new muffler design that does not block the air. There are several of us who can attest to the poor "airblocking" design of the stock muffler. It is empirical and observed data not just our opinion.

Regards

 

[Gierkink]

Saber,

Which muffler replacement solution are you using?


Rob

 

[CHAD]

This 20 degrees cooler, what kind of driving are we talking about? Cruising perhaps? What benefit does running 20 degrees cooler give during this activity?

 

[saber]

This 20 degrees cooler, what kind of driving are we talking about? Cruising perhaps? What benefit does running 20 degrees cooler give during this activity?

20 degrees cooler is my observed avg for all driving. Biggest impact was with City driving stop and go.

I am using Bob Ida's Tube mufflers. Sound is great and not too loud.

 

[barondw]

This 20 degrees cooler, what kind of driving are we talking about? Cruising perhaps? What benefit does running 20 degrees cooler give during this activity?

Chad

You can doubt everything about the temps. But when your car reaches 235-240 it is the danger point. This happens to many GTs in normal driving not even getting on it or an the track.

So anything that really lowers temp is a worthwhile improvement in my opinion.

Dave

 

[Silverbullitt]

You can't run too cool. Every degree drop is another several miles of healthy life for the mechanicals. Who knows this might be why the transaxle seems to boil over without a cooler.

 

[QKSTNG514]

Wanted to interject here a few points. One is a tune CAN lower temps by having the fans come on earler and run longer.

The stock HP/TQ numbers we have seen on several GT's has been in the 530's for RWHP and 460's RWTQ.

With the tune that we and several other SCT dealers offer you usually see in the 550's RWHP and in the 510-525 RWTQ..

The TQ is what you feel in he seat of the pants and thats where the Permagrin comes from!

One thing to note is that Ford does ramp down the A/F pretty hard down in the low 11's and into the high 10's on some of the cars.

Keeping the A/F at 11.8 - 12.0 does wonders for the power!

TonY G

 

[TrackDay]

With the GT you will not lower the peak temperatures by turning the fans on earlier or longer for that matter.
This car is different. The problem is heat soak under the hood resulting from poor air circulation from the engine bay. Turning the fans on early or for loner will only lower the temperature on a temporary basis. It will do nothing for the peak temperatures!

I’ve been there already. I’ve already gone to the track, walked out with a cold engine, run around 70 mph at the slowest part of the track. This is pushing much more air across the radiators than those two fans ever could. Still the temperatures just climb and climb / up to 235 getting close to 240 before I decide to end the session. Same exact experience stuck in traffic or driving slow around town on a hot summer day!

If anyone has empirical data to show that turning the fans on earlier or for longer time eliminates the climbing temperatures on the GT while driving slowly around town / stuck in traffic on the highway on a hot (90 plus) summer day / or for that matter driving the car hard at WOT conditions at the track on a cool 75 or 80 deg. for 20 plus minutes at a clip lets hear it. Who out there can report back they are running with the fans coming on early in their GT and they no longer observe the heat soak issue, climbing temperatures, the very high peak temperatures on the track.

In two weeks my car will be at Ida Automotive www.idaautomotive.com / getting rid of the muffler and having his exhaust installed. Several here have already reported it works with peak temperatures reduced by 20 deg. This is real significant. Just do it or enjoy watching your temperature gauge climb when driving slow or at the track with the knowledge that your engine temperature truly is 240.

If you still want a custom tune Bob Ida can offer this too but if you just go with his exhaust you are not adding a “chip / aftermarket box” to the stock computer, you retain the stock cats, the sound level is very reasonable so you pass emissions without a hitch and the full Ford warrantee remains in tact.

Looking forward to 220 peak temps.

PS: This post is not negative about any one or any vendor on this forum.

 

[CHAD]

The problem is the supercharger. I have been driving my TT FGT around for a while now in fairly warm FL weather and have yet to see 190 degrees with the air on, regardless of the flogging I give the car. It very rarely leaves the 180 mark, meaning I have to try REALLY hard. :biggrin