STORMCAT Carbon Ceramic Brake Conversion

[STORMCAT]

Terry, Juan, Mr Shadowman, Mr Adams , Jeffy, Carl.. ( No Nuts Yet..:bored ) , Shelby , Many, Chris A, Kendal, Frank, Indy, Thanks for all the kind words !! Yes it was a true labor of love. If I would have spent as much time on a career choice as I did on this project I could afford to be driving a Veyron !! Not !!.. :biggrin Hope to see you all at the Rally !! B.

 

[STORMCAT]

You are going to use the OEM "caliper" and a traditional friction material? And there is no contamination considerations? Or using the assumption / plan there will not be any movement, and they will just touch?

Project is very cool, I was just curious, as here in MA they actually check for the e-brake for inspection (well maybe not closely when the GT is in the bay.....)

Great question Mr. Specracer !! I see great minds think alike..:thumbsup I had the same questions and concerns. As part of my home work I present photo exhibit A & B. E brakes from some Lambo's with CC Brakes. I was lucky enough to find some that were showing their part numbers.. It is the same E-Brake pad part number as on the GT.. Case closed ...:biggrin

 

[Specracer]

Where is the "Staples" button, "that was easy"..... probably about the only super easy part of the whole project.

Again great work

Great question Mr. Specracer !! I see great minds think alike..:thumbsup I had the same questions and concerns. As part of my home work I present photo exhibit A & B. E brakes from some Lambo's with CC Brakes. I was lucky enough to find some that were showing their part numbers.. It is the same E-Brake pad part number as on the GT.. Case closed ...:biggrin

 

[2112]

Wow, What a project.

Are you or Brembo going to offer a complete kit?

:usa

 

[Shadowman]

Terry, Juan, Mr Shadowman, Mr Adams , Jeffy, Carl.. ( No Nuts Yet..:bored ) , Shelby , Many, Chris A, Kendal, Frank, Indy, Thanks for all the kind words !! Yes it was a true labor of love. If I would have spent as much time on a career choice as I did on this project I could afford to be driving a Veyron !! Not !!.. :biggrin Hope to see you all at the Rally !! B.

The comments are well deserved

Now STORMCAT you had me smiling through the following "If I would have spent as much time on a career choice as I did on this project I could afford to be driving a Veyron!!" and then you lost me when you said "NOT!!"; LOL

STORMCAT all of the ground work and integration has been well presented and the results look wonderful however I now have two questions;

1. Will the system as designed/created by you and your team fit within the OEM optional BBS wheels
2. How are you going to validate the resulting brake bias and assuming that it needs to be tweaked are you going to integrate an adjustable proportioning valve or a rate specific valve once the adjustment needed to maintain the proper bias is determined?

Takes care

Shadowman

 

[roketman]

Brian ,
Looks awesome !!
But I don't understand ???
Brakes only slow you down ???????
Aren't you slow enough ?????
OK seriously I am very interested .Please call or email me on the pricing and availability!!!
If they are as nice as my cup holders ,I'm in heaven!!!!
Bests to you my buddy !!!!
Roketman

 

[freeflyer]

Looks GREAT Brian! Keep your seat belts on tight to avoid bruises.

 

[Superfly]

Great job Brian, simply awesome, and very fitting for your (and all of our) GT's. But I'm not buying new wheels, so we've got to figure how we're gonna fit them into the 18" fronts..... LOL

 

[STORMCAT]

The comments are well deserved

Now STORMCAT you had me smiling through the following "If I would have spent as much time on a career choice as I did on this project I could afford to be driving a Veyron!!" and then you lost me when you said "NOT!!"; LOL

STORMCAT all of the ground work and integration has been well presented and the results look wonderful however I now have two questions;



1. Will the system as designed/created by you and your team fit within the OEM optional BBS wheels
2. How are you going to validate the resulting brake bias and assuming that it needs to be tweaked are you going to integrate an adjustable proportioning valve or a rate specific valve once the adjustment needed to maintain the proper bias is determined?

Takes care

Shadowman

1) This system requires a 19" front wheel or a super custom built 18" wheel. There are some good 19" tires so I went 19" The real challenge was finding a 19" wheel that was as light as the OEM wheels. That's what took so long to put the car on the road was wait for my new wheels.

2) I do not plan to make any other changes to the braking system. The GT's ABS and EBD ( Electronic Brake Force Distribution) seems to be handling my equal system set up just fine.
There is only a 5% difference in between the front and rear of the stock system which is minimal. Worn tire diameters are always throwing variables at the stock system so it has the ability to adjust to some discrepancies and constant changing conditions.

There was always a trump card I learned from Brembo. If there was an issue the rear pads could be trimed to reach the desired brake force.

As far as official validation. The burnishing process was enough for me. I have jumped on the brakes many times now and there are no issues. Stops are true and straight no rear lock up. Under real hard "Trying " to lock up the brakes type of stops The right front seems to be the first tire that start to chirp, which makes sense . The driver is on the left and adds some weight to that side so the tire bites a little better. If any one has some brake test equipment bring it to the rally .:biggrin

 

[STORMCAT]

Wow, What a project.

Are you or Brembo going to offer a complete kit?

:usa

Brembo , doubt it,,, me probaly... but after the rally,, I just buried with stuff now,,, Email me if you are interested.

 

[STORMCAT]

Looks GREAT Brian! Keep your seat belts on tight to avoid bruises.

Thanks buddy,, How's your project coming along ?? :secret:

 

[STORMCAT]

Brian ,
Looks awesome !!
But I don't understand ???
Brakes only slow you down ???????
Aren't you slow enough ?????
OK seriously I am very interested .Please call or email me on the pricing and availability!!!
If they are as nice as my cup holders ,I'm in heaven!!!!
Bests to you my buddy !!!!
Roketman

Hey Buddy Thanks !! , Yea I'm slow.. :bored but I'm mounting some sticky tires this year !! So watch out...:lol Looking forward to following you around VIR...:biggrin

 

[Shadowman]

1) This system requires a 19" front wheel or a super custom built 18" wheel. There are some good 19" tires so I went 19" The real challenge was finding a 19" wheel that was as light as the OEM wheels. That's what took so long to put the car on the road was wait for my new wheels.

2) I do not plan to make any other changes to the braking system. The GT's ABS and EBD ( Electronic Brake Force Distribution) seems to be handling my equal system set up just fine.
There is only a 5% difference in between the front and rear of the stock system which is minimal. Worn tire diameters are always throwing variables at the stock system so it has the ability to adjust to some discrepancies and constant changing conditions.

There was always a trump card I learned from Brembo. If there was an issue the rear pads could be trimed to reach the desired brake force.

As far as official validation. The burnishing process was enough for me. I have jumped on the brakes many times now and there are no issues. Stops are true and straight no rear lock up. Under real hard "Trying " to lock up the brakes type of stops The right front seems to be the first tire that start to chirp, which makes sense . The driver is on the left and adds some weight to that side so the tire bites a little better. If any one has some brake test equipment bring it to the rally .:biggrin

Thank you STORMCAT

As I have stated; the system looks very nice.

I asked about the OEM wheels knowing that your original design would not allow for the use of them but did not know if as the project unfolds whether this was to be a consideration; I do understand clearly now.

With regards to the bias; my reason for mentioning it was because of the issues with the setup as offered by "G" that were prone to bias issues. Now even with the bias off the ABS will still function as a given wheel begins to lock so it is really a question of whether the point that a given wheel begins to lock is in sync with the balancing act of the gal/system. Rotor size, weight, friction material, etc all play part in this process; thank you for the comments.

Now as for your validation process; there is no doubt that seat of the pants is important and I remain confident in you that if there was an issues that you would have already addressed it as you have methodically migrated through this project. I restate that my question stemmed from days gone past as well as personal experience and stopping a gal quickly in a straight line is different than stopping at gal at speed while turning; it is during turning that the bias comes into play and if not correct can cause a gal to change ends very quickly.

Keep it up STORMCAT as this is a very nice project and IMO once ready for primetime an awesome addition to the gals.

Takes care

Shadowman

 

[BlackICE]

...I restate that my question stemmed from days gone past as well as personal experience and stopping a gal quickly in a straight line is different than stopping at gal at speed while turning; it is during turning that the bias comes into play and if not correct can cause a gal to change ends very quickly...
Shadowman

No better place to than VIR during the Rally to fine tune and verify the new braking system. A an sure that the foremost experts on FGT handing will there and willing to lend a hand.

 

[ChipBeck]

No better place to than VIR during the Rally to fine tune and verify the new braking system. A an sure that the foremost experts on FGT handing will there and willing to lend a hand.

Ice,

One of my favorite memories of Daniel was at the bar after our "track day" in Las Vegas at Rally II. Dan looked at me and said, "after observing the events of today, it appears that all Ford GT owners are expert drivers and they follow instructions faultlessly". :lol

Chip

 

[Shadowman]

Great chatting with you STORMCAT; you truly have done well.

Takes care

Shadowman

 

[2112]

Brembo , doubt it,,, me probaly... but after the rally,, I just buried with stuff now,,, Email me if you are interested.

I completely understand your reasons but I am 110% happy with the OEM BBS upgrade wheel so that may be the deal breaker for me personally.

Still very impressed. :thumbsup

.

 

[ChipBeck]

Brian,

What a great thread. Please keep me in the loop. Is anybody else interested in buying a set of Stormcat's super lightweight 19/19 F/R wheels. I believe the minimum is 3 sets per order.

Chip

 

[STORMCAT]

Thank you STORMCAT

As I have stated; the system looks very nice.

I asked about the OEM wheels knowing that your original design would not allow for the use of them but did not know if as the project unfolds whether this was to be a consideration; I do understand clearly now.

With regards to the bias; my reason for mentioning it was because of the issues with the setup as offered by "G" that were prone to bias issues. Now even with the bias off the ABS will still function as a given wheel begins to lock so it is really a question of whether the point that a given wheel begins to lock is in sync with the balancing act of the gal/system. Rotor size, weight, friction material, etc all play part in this process; thank you for the comments.

Now as for your validation process; there is no doubt that seat of the pants is important and I remain confident in you that if there was an issues that you would have already addressed it as you have methodically migrated through this project. I restate that my question stemmed from days gone past as well as personal experience and stopping a gal quickly in a straight line is different than stopping at gal at speed while turning; it is during turning that the bias comes into play and if not correct can cause a gal to change ends very quickly.

Keep it up STORMCAT as this is a very nice project and IMO once ready for primetime an awesome addition to the gals.

Takes care

Shadowman

Hey Bill, Thank you for all of the positive comments. It was great to speak with you as well. I always appreciate the questions and feed back. I really cannot comment on the Wilwood brake situation.
Hard braking in a starlight line on a surface with uniform traction can give you some good feedback. If you invoke a high weight transfer and un weight the rear end in a straight line you will know if you have an obvious bias problem. The ratios I have are so close to stock that I am really not concerned about it. I have logged about 300 miles On the new system. I have driven my car around on ramps and many curves here and I have braked fairly hard on them with no adverse side effects.

As far as the comments about braking on the track I'll throw this out there. Forgetting about a Fiat X19 I had many years ago :ack The Ford GT is my first rear engine car that let's say could get you hurt. Braking a rear engine car or any rear weight biased car around corners at the limit is very different from a front engine car that most of us are use to.
Chip brought up a good reference about the LV track day. There were many a GT that spun by over braking in the one infamous corner. And those cars were all equipped with the OE ABS brake system. I had the GT come around on me at a different track venue by over braking. Once you start the weight transfer and start to un weight the rear wheels even the best ABS system won't save you if you have the dynamics wrong.
I've logged 14 000 mile on my GT and have had some good track time in it. I have a pretty good feel for the balance of the car. I would say that if you would spin my car in a turn that was caused by over braking you would spin a stock GT under the same dynamics conditions.

As far as actual braking while on the race track. In general proper technique is to do the majority of your braking in a straight line before you turn or get into the corner. Some corners may require some trail braking but at this point it should not be anywhere near a hard or lock up situation unless you need to avoid a accident. If you are applying the brakes extremely hard in a turn you did not enter it properly.. Roketman can you cofirm if I was paying attention at drivers school. :rolleyes

I'll look forward to speaking to you more about the project.. Sincerely, B.