GT in September Road & Track

[fjpikul]

eShrink, you left out that the FDA does not approve or verify any car manufacturers claims, CMS and the Congress don't investigate or establish standards for car manufacturesrs other than crashworthiness and safety, and who knows what kind of credentials the journalists have to their names. I would like to see anew mag come out called "Road and Driver Trend." Perhaps the spoof on Consumer Reports printed on this forum a while back wasn't so bad.

 

[eshrink]

fjpikul:

I am certain that you understood that my point was not directed toward or against any or all car magazines. They are, once again, organs for the hobbyist.

The problem comes when someone/anyone begins to take the reporting seriously or a hobby itself as something more than a means to pass idle time.

We all know people who crowd around a television to watch a sport which they cannot play, yelling great expletives at players that they will never meet, and grieving a game which is only as meaningful as the degree to which you invest in it.

The car magazines...gun magazines...stereo magazines...biker magazines...etc ad nauseum, play to the obsessive mentality that lacks a reality check.

If you ask someone "what does it matter if your G-06 is faster or slower than a FireAreWe," there truly is not answer...simply because, in the real world, it does not matter.

Attaching meaning to the meaningless is entirely arbitrary.

Your career may be crucial, your family may be critical and your friendships may be essential. However, the number of spokes in your wheels is inconsequential.

- doc

 

[fjpikul]

Well said, and point taken.

 

[Piccola]

Medicine & cars working together...

Not to get in between you two docs, but...not ALL car-related articles are like this (as fjpikul points out). :wink In fact, there are quite a few articles on cars that have to go through the same exact process of getting approved for publication in authoritative journals as the articles you guys write on pathology, psychiatry, etc (just substitute the FDA for the DOT). Check out some of the articles in Journal of Biomechanics, Medical Engineering & Physics, Spine... Granted, these are not the types of articles published in car mags or that normal car enthusiasts pick up & read for enjoyment, & they have nothing to do w/0-60 or 1/4 mile speeds, but they are definitely a lot of fun to work on :biggrin & much more important that seeing how fast your car goes!!!

How many times have we seen awesome wrecks that completely totalled cars, & wondered in amazement at how the driver was able to somehow get out of this mangled mess & walk away w/minor injuries? Part of the fun w/working in neurosurgery at the Med College of WI was getting to crash cars. :lol I'm serious... A short drive from the main hospital to the VA's crash lab on "crash day" & you get to watch a $50,000 Lexus fly down a track w/a dummy & total itself in a brilliant head-on collision. Although quite technical, precise, & time consuming (for each car) this research kicks butt! Each time these cars are crashed, the data collected is what allow the engineers to design cars that continue to be safer & safer - especially for those of us (& even those non-authoritative magazine article writers) who take extra risks on the road or track! :banana

 

[fjpikul]

Boy, I can't wait to meet you in person. Want to see my collection of plasticized brains?

 

[Piccola]

Boy, I can't wait to meet you in person. Want to see my collection of plasticized brains?

Before we share brains... Don't you want to know how many "skeletons" I have in my closet? :rofl

 

[fjpikul]

Piccola, I have enough bones laying around for both of us. Don't need your skeletons cluttering things up. We shouldn't hijack this thread.

 

[FordGTGuy]

FordGTGuy,
What is the difference between a "plain" F430 and an F430 F1?

Eric

different transmission

 

[EasyEric]

Thanks FordGTguy for the clarification.

Doc(s),
I found the magazine article mildy enteratining and at first, informative. The fact the GT finished "5th" in track time was only of passing concern.

Virtually EVERY car fan I know, is curious about how their favorite "ride" stacks up to other cars. This innate curiousity is best reflected in the old adage "...the first automobile race was held the day the second one was built". However, the average car enthusiast does not have the opprotunity to determine the relative performance of their car (certainly not under controlled conditions) because of a host of reasons. Automobile magazines DO HAVE the wherewithal to do this, and in this role can be a valuable information tool (e.g., those looking to purchase a car) or to just satisfy curiosity and thus build interest in the "hobby".

My susbsequent chagrin (mild as it was) stemmed from the magazine's lack of disclosure about the racing tires on the Italian cars and the advantage this would give and the impact it would have on the writers' driving "impressions" (thanks again Bart for discovering this).

For me, it's not a case of vicarious self esteem enrichment via automobile performance (I chose summarily and definitively when I purchased my GT), rather it's the engineer in me that deplores the squandering of the opportunity (so many wonderful cars together at once) and the shoddy execution (failing to test all cars on stock rubber) of what was billed as an ostensibly "fair" comparison. :thumbsup


Eric

 

[Gulf GT]

This is fun. I had no idea that by joining this forum I was going to get a refresher course in philosophy 25 years after I graduated from college. You guys really make this stuff great with all these different points of view. Definitely more intersting than just simple grunt responses.

As for myself, after I read the article in Road & Track, I kicked my cat. Oh yeah, I don't have a cat. :biggrin

 

[eshrink]

GulkGT:

Actually, it is not philosophy. It is the Scientific Method. In order to compare two or more objects (let's say acceleration) you must control the independent variables (true weight, true horsepower/torque, true reaction time, temperature, humidity, etc) to see the impact on the dependent variable (elapsed time).

Magazines do this quite "informally". Different cars, different tracks, different drivers and so on.

Then they publish their "findings" knowing that controversy sells publications (except for the New York Times) and wait for the letters of outrage.

So I have come to this; I think the life cycle is all backwards.

• You should start out dead and get it out of the way.

• Then, you wake up in an old age home feeling better every day.

• So you get kicked out for being too healthy; go collect your pension, then when you start work...you get a gold watch on your first day.

• You work 40 years until you're young enough to enjoy your retirement.

• You drink alcohol, you party, you're generally promiscuous and you get ready for High School.

• Then you go to primary school, you become a kid , you play, you have no responsibilities, you become a baby and then...

• You spend your last 9 months floating peacefully in luxury, in spa-like conditions; central heating, room service on tap, larger quarters every day

You finish off as an orgasm


- doc

 

[EasyEric]

Classically funny Doc!

By the way, in case you don't do this already, you might want to keep an eye on the GT owners section for an imminent Atlanta area get together.

Eric

 

[eshrink]

Eric:

The humor was unintentional. When it occurs, it is quite accidental.

My only points were that:

a. Magazine articles are meant solely for entertainment. Do not base your mood, contentment, fulfillment or justify your purchases based upon them, Yes, Brad truly did marry Angelina.

Journal articles are designed to educate. Do not base your decisions upon them until/unless you understand them thoroughly. No, your antihypertensive will not make your penis fall off.

It is deeply concerning to read the ire, agitation, and desperation that arises when some publication finds that your car not quite as fast as someone else's car.

The psychology of that is truly fascinating: To wit, we have the concept that someone buys an object and then becomes morbidly depressed because a magazine says that someone else's purchase was a more informed decision.

Gee, if magazines ever caught wind of how they could manipulate mood and the marketplace, they would begin doing such things deliberately.

Let's see, you could sell the AB Lounge and the Chia Pet.

Honestly, this could happen....even in America.

- doc

 

[Gulf GT]

GulkGT:
So I have come to this; I think the life cycle is all backwards...

My wife is a shrink too, she got that email a couple weeks ago from one of her other "shrinken" head buddies. Pretty funny. You guys have great stuff floating around the internet all the time she shares with me. Sum of it I dun't understund though.

 

[eshrink]

If life begins and ends with magazine articles, this one should at least be pleasantly familiar:

 

[Gulf GT]

Yep it felt good. Thanks for the RX doc! :thumbsup

 

[Bart Carter]

Car and Driver compariaon

In most articles I have read, the GT bests or equals the ZO6 and easily bests the Viper on the track. I am still puzzled by the Road and Track results. But many tire heat cycles in this particular "Europe's only press-fleet" car would certainly account for that.

In the new Car and Driver, they didn't test the GT, but they did test the Z06 and the Ferrari F430 F1. The F430 did not have the track tires this time and the difference was dramatic. The Z06 was 2.35 seconds faster than the Ferrari. IMO that would put the GT well over 2 seconds a lap faster than the Ferrari under even conditions.

 

[EasyEric]

Bart,

I believe Ferrari knows this and has reacted by denying to supply cars to magazines for comparison tests...shying away from a stand-up fight is un-American! :biggrin

Eric

 

[BlackICE]

Most of these test have to be taken with a large grain of salt! I am not a great driver, but anyone who has done any track time, knows that tires and suspension settings make a huge difference in the handling of any car and this will mask any of small of differences between the cars. Also I will venture to say that a world class driver that is familiar with any one of these car would easily beat any amateur "race" driver with any of these cars, assuming that all cars had racing tires and the correct suspension setup for the course.

Magazines are out to maximize ad revenue to drive profits. To do that, they write stuff that will be entertaining to its audience and not offensive to its advertisers. Fairness and accuracy are not high on the priority list.

BlackICE

 

[Red Rocket]

different transmission

specifically, the F1 transmission is the paddle shifter version. Great on a track; not so great in normal city traffic as it is hard on the clutch. The GT is a dream to drive in traffic by any standard, but care must be taken not to slip it to much or even it will overheat the plates.