Axle Failure for the SECOND time

[analogdesigner]

I just stay close to home...

While I hate to say it, this is really starting to sour the ownership experience. I am sure I am not the only one that feels this way. I am sure this will eventually be dealt with, what do we do in the meantime? I have only 1600 miles on mine, and I am scared to drive it now. I haven't driven mine in a month, and it looks like I wont be driving it anytime soon.:frown

ROCMAN,

I also am afraid to go further than a few miles from my home until I am satified that a real solution has been created. :confused Jay

 

[BlackICE]

ROCMAN,

I also am afraid to go further than a few miles from my home until I am satified that a real solution has been created. :confused Jay

You are playing right into Ford's hand. If none of us drive our cars due to fear, then the failures will stop and the problem in Ford's view, goes away.

Remember, the only thing we have to fear, is fear itself, or should I say the fear of getting stranded in an area without cell phone coverage.

DBK is in a tough spot, being the forum creator, GT owner and also a Ford employee. But if anyone can get the official position on this issue, DBK can. However I don't hold much hope. DBK will encouraged to focus on his job at Ford and not on his personal forum and not to poke his nose into areas not in his scope of assignments. Ford's primary focus is on the very survival of Ford itself. Keeping all of us GT owners happy, is way, way down on the priority list.

Our money is spent and high end car buyers were never a target market for Ford. The GT would have fit better as an Aston Martin vehicle, however due to the history and heritage of the GT, it had to be sold as a Ford.

 

[B O N Y]

You are playing right into Ford's hand. If none of us drive our cars due to fear, then the failures will stop and the problem in Ford's view, goes away.

Remember, the only thing we have to fear, is fear itself, or should I say the fear of getting stranded in an area without cell phone coverage.

DBK is in a tough spot, being the forum creator, GT owner and also a Ford employee. But if anyone can get the official position on this issue, DBK can. However I don't hold much hope. DBK will encouraged to focus on his job at Ford and not on his personal forum and not to poke his nose into areas not in his scope of assignments. Ford's primary focus is on the very survival of Ford itself. Keeping all of us GT owners happy, is way, way down on the priority list.

Our money is spent and high end car buyers were never a target market for Ford. The GT would have fit better as an Aston Martin vehicle, however due to the history and heritage of the GT, it had to be sold as a Ford.

DBK is not a Ford employee, his father is.

We know members of the Ford GT team monitor this site, but have they advised the mother ship of this issue? Well, as I understand it DBK will.

 

[nota4re]

We have a solution that many design engineers feel comfortable with. Next is a stress analysis and possibly even a non-linear analysis ($$$).

Jay, I can likely get the non-linear analysis done with the best tools in the business if you're interested. PM me.

 

[bigdan40]

Assuming this is a "true" problem. Ford as no company will ever take full responsibility for the issue but in the interest of humoring those with a concern may offer a solution to a "preceived" problem that some customers may feel exist with the GT. They will probably take a page from the Z8 bmw. There was significant concern regarding the body/frame. The front strut mount at the top was deforming and was felt to be a flaw design by some. BMW stated it was almost always associated with some type of unusual stress to the frame (ie driver error). Some reported a bad pot hole is all that was required to cause the deformation of the stut tower mount. Solution by BMW was to offer a brace to bridge the two front strut towers as an aftermarket purchase to those customers who were concerned at the customers cost of course. This allowed them to offer a solution for a problem deflect any blame and incur no cost. Ford could do the same and offers some aftermaket fix at the customers cost. It would satisfy the bean counters and offer a solution but at the cost to the customer. Again this assumes a true problem and a cohesive front by owners.
A reliable source told me once that certain cadillacs can explode on its underside without damage to the occupants. Rather than isssue a recall if it occurs cadillac "investigates" the issue and gives you a new car no questions asked. It is cheaper than a recall and avoids poor publicity. I personally cannot verify this happening since I don't own or ever had an exploding Cadillac. But I kind of trust the source. On the Z8 the vanos was also notorious for failing. There was no question about this. I had mine replaced. And yes I paid for it since the car was off warantee.

Not unlike when the early Prowlers came out. Alcoa was producing the chassis
and although only 300 or so Prowlers were built in 1997 which was their first year, Chrysler stopped production for a whole freakin' year and got it right. Something about the heat treating of the chassis was inferior and the result was breaking at some of the stressed weld points.

What none of us wants to see happen but it seems inevitable is when one of us will be clippin' down the highway at a high speed and this part failure will occur. The result easily can be tragic and then Ford will not only have to address the issue but probably will have a huge law suit on their hands for this topic has been documented feverishly. It's pitiful business on their part.

 

[SLF360]

DBK is in a tough spot, being the forum creator, GT owner and also a Ford employee. But if anyone can get the official position on this issue, DBK can. However I don't hold much hope. DBK will encouraged to focus on his job at Ford and not on his personal forum and not to poke his nose into areas not in his scope of assignments. Ford's primary focus is on the very survival of Ford itself. Keeping all of us GT owners happy, is way, way down on the priority list.

Dear BlackICE,

I frankly can only find your post insulting, inaccurate and injust, most of all DBK deserves full respect here.
Mere speculation, your vision of things bears no resemblance of reality in any form. DBK has always treated all aspects discussed with neutrality, and initiated attention to be given from Ford as things became clearer also on the bolt issue, being close to the right people, as explained correctly by Bony.

For the record: From the very beginning I can only state that the attention from everybody here, and the Ford engineers and project leaders has been incredible. Very supportive, and helpful, whenever there was a question or issue. Without their help, I probably would not have gotten my car here to Italy without any problems, and anything of an issue is treated with an attention beyond imagination.

Just these days another aspect requiring some support has come up, and again I am impressed that I am not looked at as the one 'driving it in the desert', but - be it forum members or SVT team - support is right there... Thank you DBK, thank you Bony, thank you all at SVT.

The bolt issue, well, is that the only thing actually we complain about ? Oh, there was the Mac delete issue or woofer repositioning..


Car is spectacular. Not only as a incredibly well engineered piece of true automotive art, but as an experience thru and thru. My opinion,

yours truly


SLF360

PS: Only pity: couldn't make it to the rally....:confused

 

[abolfaz]

The first time mine failed in August at 1920 miles it was the rt side that broke but they replaced BOTH sides as a preventive. HA!

You guys know my story. First one breaks, then the second one breaks the next day after I get the car back. If I have another bolt failure, I won't bother doing anything but setting the car on fire on the spot.

 

[abolfaz]

Prowler,
I discussed Jay's theory with the Maroone service manager. They've fixed 5 or 6 cars and according to him they have not had one come back so who knows??? I feel your frustration...:ack

Let me be the first to tell you that service manager is FULL OF SHIT.

 

[SLF360]

Let me be the first to tell you that service manager is FULL OF SHIT.

I think I know who you are talking about...:lol But they also have committed techstaff there, I think it is fair to say.

 

[Gimbal]

Jay, is there any chance of getting some details on your solution? I am a mechanical engineer, 25 years. I've attached many things to many other things that breaking or falling off is just plain old not an option. I've designed many things that are attached to satilites, helicopters, F16's, etc. I am also in an effort to find a fix, but on my own it is time consuming. Has anyone done or could have done a failure anyalysis on any broken bolts? Was it fatique or over loaded? Together with all of our experience we should be ablet to figure this one out.

 

[abolfaz]

I think I know who you are talking about...:lol But they also have committed techstaff there, I think it is fair to say.

True. But the service manager there is the one who tells me (after I point out two huge scratches on my car) "Thats what happens when these cars are here this long...!"

 

[abolfaz]

Jay, is there any chance of getting some details on your solution?

Am I the only one thats never seen two little bolts holding an output shaft like this? Every car I've ever had including VW'S! have had one BIG bolt holding things together. Frankly I was shocked when I saw what was holding things together on the FGT, why would they cut corners like this?

As far as reliability is concerned, I really don't drive my car at all anymore, I just don't feel comfortable enough to take it anywhere except within a couple of mile radius from my house.

 

[SLF360]

True. But the service manager there is the one who tells me (after I point out two huge scratches on my car) "Thats what happens when these cars are here this long...!"

What a Dick.... And you said: Guess what happens, when such happens....'Crocodile pond' !:eek

 

[abolfaz]

What a Dick....

You should have seen the look on brians face!

This is the way I see it guys, the car is incredible. Most of us here never even dreamed of buying a $175k+ car from Ford, the work Ford did on this car start to finish is unparalleled, in light of that we invested BIG money in our dream car but judging by the way the axle thing is being handled (let alone the way my car has been handled) we deserve better than this.

If I wasn't so in love with my car it would have been gone long ago, this changing bolts and washers in my opinion is BS.

 

[KMCBOSS]

I have an appointment to have my bolts replaced tomorrow - Can't help but wonder if it is worth the effort.

 

[nota4re]

KMC,

Be sure to let the service department know that you are interested in the exact status of the bolts/washer as they find them. It seems that some cars have more spline play than others (this is purely my conjecture) and are therefore more prone to problems. If your dealership performs the update on bolts/washers that are already good - then I'd feel pretty good about driving the car. If, however, they find one or more loose or broken bolts, then I'd still be waiting for a better fix than what is available today.

As I said earlier in this thread, I have '06 #1208. I inspected the driver's side (disassembled it actually) and both bolts were tight, properly torqued, and the washer was fine (no warping).

Truth be told, my 15 year old son performed the disassembly (except for the subject bolts which I wanted to "feel" myself.) It took him about 40 minutes which included putting the car on the lift and elevating the rear tires a couple of inches. The point is that access to and upgrading the components is not a difficult task.

 

[ROCMAN]

With all the failures on most stock cars, how are these TT or whipple cars holding up? It would seem that they would fail more often.

Blackice,
I think my safety, and that of my wife or son, is more important than trying to prove a point to Ford.

 

[HHGT]

KMC,

Be sure to let the service department know that you are interested in the exact status of the bolts/washer as they find them. It seems that some cars have more spline play than others (this is purely my conjecture) and are therefore more prone to problems. If your dealership performs the update on bolts/washers that are already good - then I'd feel pretty good about driving the car. If, however, they find one or more loose or broken bolts, then I'd still be waiting for a better fix than what is available today.

As I said earlier in this thread, I have '06 #1208. I inspected the driver's side (disassembled it actually) and both bolts were tight, properly torqued, and the washer was fine (no warping).

Truth be told, my 15 year old son performed the disassembly (except for the subject bolts which I wanted to "feel" myself.) It took him about 40 minutes which included putting the car on the lift and elevating the rear tires a couple of inches. The point is that access to and upgrading the components is not a difficult task.

Kendall, when you get the new kits in, I prefer to have Ryan work on my car. He's younger, energetic and far more charismatic than the old man. Besides, we can drink some wine while watching him work.

 

[Speed Thrills]

As far as reliability is concerned, I really don't drive my car at all anymore, I just don't feel comfortable enough to take it anywhere except within a couple of mile radius from my house.

I think many feel this way and this is a serious blow to the whole GT program as no other car in this price range, above or below has their owners in the state where they fear to drive their cars. Imagine the failures if these GTs were driven as much as other cars like the Z06. We have a serious problem on our hands and I don't think telling people that a 15 year old kid can change out the bolts make it any better. Where is Ford on this??

 

[Kayvan]

Very sorry to hear about this a second time.

Putting on the ice-cold actuarial (insurance PhD type)/failure hat.

From the official mfg. disclosure of % of failures and the posts on this board, it appears this effects a very small percentage of vehicles <1%.

The only way a manufacturer or supplier/vendor is going to respond is thru cold hard data. And to get their attention, all the failures need to be captured by the dealer warranty system which will be uploaded to a central claim count database sorted by VIN, powertrain subsystems, etc. If the claims exceed an insurance industry ratio for this specific product, then and only then will full and complete solution be engineered, offered or paid.

Further, from personal experience all super cars experience this in the first 2 yrs of the run and upgrades are incorporated. Happened with Murcielago steering column leeks, Ferrari software, etc. In addition a very small percentage of cars are true Lemons (ie, a concentration of: poor manufacturing quality, defective parts, low QC, and materials failure statistically occuring in one product). The mfg. knows this, reserves for it and eats these as test beds/prototypes and settles lemon-law suits for pr, dealer goodwill, and product liability/safety issues.

This system works, and allows for those liberal 3-10 yr warranty's out there. In rare cases, its catastrophic (Goodyear Explorer, Audi sudden acceleration) and the mfg. pays thru the nose.

Unfortunately, in a 4000 car run, we will not benefit from the 2yr nits/bugs workout and some cars, 5-10 will be true lemons.

Pile-ing on to the next/current failure will be frustrating and at best shave value of resale in 2017 when some newbie reads this link.

Get em into the dealer, lets get an accurate claim count and then you will be heard.