An Affordable Car for the Masses - Henry Ford's Legacy

[TO AWSUM]

I think it is a shame that FORD has lost the vision of Henry Ford, "an affordable car for the masses". Who, but the wealthy, can afford these overpriced new vehicles like a $100K+ pickup truck? I think all the automakers need to fire at least 50% of their software engineers and only keep the ones that design engine tuning, transmission shifting and manufacturing efficiencies. These other computer people want to put expensive computer modules (made in China) into every component even when it's not needed. Adding air pressure sensors in tires, replacing bulbs with computer-controlled assemblies, mechanical shocks with computer-controlled adaptive electric shocks, etc., etc. is just driving costs unnecessarily through the roof. We don't need overly complicated vehicles at exorbitant prices. We need easily maintainable cars at reasonable prices without all the complications. Let the consumer decide which options they want on a vehicle instead of shoving all these expensive non-options down their throat. Why do you think the popular car programs on TV are all resurrecting vehicles that were manufactured before all these computer-controlled vehicles? It's because the old vehicles can be maintained by the average Joe and much less expensively. Wake up FORD to your traditions - "an affordable car for the masses"!!!!

 

[fjpikul]

Car? Ford still makes cars? Only suvs and trucks in the US. Listening to corporate, everything will run on batteries soon enough.

 

[2112]

Interesting.

And I agree with you. But the world is changing. New buyers aren’t like most of us old coots.

I think manufacturers are positioning themselves to become tech companies that deliver pods of transportation.

I believe in 20 years, the vast majority of new vehicles will not be privately owned. They will owned by ride sharing businesses that in many cases will be the manufacturers themselves.

 

[Cobraguy]

^^^^^Sad but true

 

[2112]

. Why do you think the popular car programs on TV are all resurrecting vehicles that were manufactured before all these computer-controlled vehicles? It's because the old vehicles can be maintained by the average Joe and much less expensively.

I see this as a good thing. It will all be dependent upon fuel availability. They are going after new ICE vehicles now, but if their objectives aren’t met, I can see them going after fuel next. At the very least with carbon taxes (like in my state) but since they are confident enough to outlaw ICE vehicles, I don’t know what would keep them from doing that with fuel.

 

[roketman]

Sell all your gas powered cars now!
Before they are worthless!

 

[2112]

 

[twobjshelbys]

We need easily maintainable cars at reasonable prices without all the complications. Let the consumer decide which options they want on a vehicle instead of shoving all these expensive non-options down their throat. Why do you think the popular car programs on TV are all resurrecting vehicles that were manufactured before all these computer-controlled vehicles? It's because the old vehicles can be maintained by the average Joe and much less expensively. Wake up FORD to your traditions - "an affordable car for the masses"!!!!

Yep. The idea of the high tech parts sure make them appealing but all but unrepairable by mere mortals. Plus, the idea that you'll be able to restore any vehicle recently made in 30 years (like we do with Mustangs and Broncos) is probably going to be impossible. The embedded electronics will be unavailable. OEM parts won't be stocked that long and the aftermarket won't be able to make them because the silicon technology will have advanced beyond the processes to do them (Which by the way is the auto industry chip problem today.)

 

[Kpgarage]

Folks, all good points. Lots of correct diagnosis here. Only one cure. Go drive your GT and enjoy it. No nannies, no gps, still has a CD player so you don’t need the inter web for tunes. That engine sound is real. The roar comes from dinosaur juice a zillion years old. That's what I’d Do before my wife makes me go shopping in the electric truck. Remember, Henry’s wife Clara drove a Detroit electric car, not a Ford. Things are funny that way.

 

[TO AWSUM]

Folks, all good points. Lots of correct diagnosis here. Only one cure. Go drive your GT and enjoy it. No nannies, no gps, still has a CD player so you don’t need the inter web for tunes. That engine sound is real. The roar comes from dinosaur juice a zillion years old. That's what I’d Do before my wife makes me go shopping in the electric truck. Remember, Henry’s wife Clara drove a Detroit electric car, not a Ford. Things are funny that way.

Let's hear from you after you wear those GT parts out and they have to be replaced. LOL Modern electric vehicles are even more of a nightmare computer and parts replacement wise with all their modules. Auto engineers don't know how to design simple and maintainable anymore - or - it is indeed a conspiracy by auto management to screw the unwary consumer and we need consumer legislation like Ralph Nadar to get the manufacturers under control.

 

[twobjshelbys]

Modern electric vehicles are even more of a nightmare computer and parts replacement wise with all their modules. Auto engineers don't know how to design simple and maintainable anymore - or - it is indeed a conspiracy by auto management to screw the unwary consumer and we need consumer legislation like Ralph Nadar to get the manufacturers under control.

I think the cause is the trend to believe a car these days is no more different from a toaster. When it wears out you throw it away and buy a new one. They're not built to be repaired. Remember when you used to be able to replace the battery in a cell phone? How long has it been since it's been impossible for mere mortals to do it (sure try but you do so without any support from the vendor and chances are you'll break it separating the pieces). I'm on the verge of having to buy a new phone because my battery won't hold a charge for 12 hours. I believe Apple has a law suit about making parts available... Cars are becoming no different.

What I don't understand is how the powers that be can mandate electric vehicles when the entry price is 50K. Those are hardly affordable. Hybrids come at a substantial premium. Until the prices are equal or less than a gas vehicle it'll be a hard sell. I predict it will happen some day but probably not by the time that CA and others have mandated the stop on gas engines.

 

[Howard]

You throw away a broken toaster?

 

[Kpgarage]

Let's hear from you after you wear those GT parts out and they have to be replaced. LOL Modern electric vehicles are even more of a nightmare computer and parts replacement wise with all their modules. Auto engineers don't know how to design simple and maintainable anymore - or - it is indeed a conspiracy by auto management to screw the unwary consumer and we need consumer legislation like Ralph Nadar to get the manufacturers under control.

Okay here you go. My red gt is 16 years old. No parts failures except gauges and I replaced those with the new speed huts. Otherwise a typical trouble free Ford. And if you’re not driving it then parts obsolescence is a moot point so not sure of your concern.
There are fewer parts in an electric car/truck. Tech is improving rapidly. I certainly agree that in many things simple is better, but not all. I’m sure model A and model T owners once complained about the new fangled 1950 Ford with it’s complicated systems. Same thing with airplanes, telephones and on and on. The real key to simple reliability is redundant systems. If a car operates off of a CAN (computer), then there needs to be a back up system and diagnostic.
My point is simply to go drive the GT and enjoy it. If you don’t enjoy it that way then why worry. I have vehicles from 1957 to 2022 in my garage. They each have their challenges and rewards.

 

[TO AWSUM]

Okay here you go. My red gt is 16 years old. No parts failures except gauges and I replaced those with the new speed huts. Otherwise a typical trouble free Ford. And if you’re not driving it then parts obsolescence is a moot point so not sure of your concern.
There are fewer parts in an electric car/truck. Tech is improving rapidly. I certainly agree that in many things simple is better, but not all. I’m sure model A and model T owners once complained about the new fangled 1950 Ford with it’s complicated systems. Same thing with airplanes, telephones and on and on. The real key to simple reliability is redundant systems. If a car operates off of a CAN (computer), then there needs to be a back up system and diagnostic.
My point is simply to go drive the GT and enjoy it. If you don’t enjoy it that way then why worry. I have vehicles from 1957 to 2022 in my garage. They each have their challenges and rewards.

Your argument supports what I was saying about needing a Ralph Nadar type of government intervention to get automakers to make affordable and economically maintainable vehicles. You assume that things will get better, but the fact is they are bad now and there is no trend showing that the automakers plan to make vehicles more affordable to purchase and maintain. You only have wishful thinking and no facts. Drive your vehicle into the ground, it doesn't matter to me, but don't be surprised when you can't get a replacement headlight for your 2006 or 2022 GT and the police start ticketing you for driving at night with a light out limiting you now to only driving it during the daylight. Wait until your tachometer fails or your speedometer and try to find an OEM unit to replace it or an affordable aftermarket part, etc., etc. What about the 2018 Raptor requiring a $4400 taillight bulb to be able to start the vehicle? I guess you feel that is acceptable engineering. We need government regulation now to keep these automakers from raping the public.

 

[2112]

We need government regulation now to keep these automakers from raping the public.

I don’t think anyone in government, even those sympathetic to automobile utility (or car culture) has any interest in doing this.

Even if they did, there are probably few hills that will be more steep to climb.

 

[Kpgarage]

Your argument supports what I was saying about needing a Ralph Nadar type of government intervention to get automakers to make affordable and economically maintainable vehicles. You assume that things will get better, but the fact is they are bad now and there is no trend showing that the automakers plan to make vehicles more affordable to purchase and maintain. You only have wishful thinking and no facts. Drive your vehicle into the ground, it doesn't matter to me, but don't be surprised when you can't get a replacement headlight for your 2006 or 2022 GT and the police start ticketing you for driving at night with a light out limiting you now to only driving it during the daylight. Wait until your tachometer fails or your speedometer and try to find an OEM unit to replace it or an affordable aftermarket part, etc., etc. What about the 2018 Raptor requiring a $4400 taillight bulb to be able to start the vehicle? I guess you feel that is acceptable engineering. We need government regulation now to keep these automakers from raping the public.

All I said was go drive your GT and enjoy. Now you’re saying we need Nader? Merry Christmas and enjoy your day. KO

 

[TO AWSUM]

All I said was go drive your GT and enjoy. Now you’re saying we need Nader? Merry Christmas and enjoy your day. KO

That is not ALL you said. You also said this, "And if you’re not driving it then parts obsolescence is a moot point so not sure of your concern." I didn't say not to drive your cars. To paraphrase, I said if you drive them a lot, you're' going to have parts break that need replacement and the modern designed parts are overpriced because they are designed poorly and do not take the consumer pricing into consideration. Ralph Nadar also had a huge hill to climb to get the auto manufacturers to start making safer cars. Now we need a champion to force them to design economically affordable parts. The military forces the aircraft manufacturers to design maintainability and economics into aircraft designs and many vehicle designs. We need a champion to force the automakers to do the same. Merry Christmas to you also and I hope you go out and drive your vehicles as I also drive mine often.

 

[extrap]

"An affordable car for the masses" does sound very nice, although isn't F's primary goal is to maximize shareholder return?

 

[TO AWSUM]

"An affordable car for the masses" does sound very nice, although isn't F's primary goal is to maximize shareholder return?

This is exactly why we need a champion to represent the consumer and to protect us from the shareholder profiteers who don't give a damn about the cars and only care about the money.

 

[extrap]

This is exactly why we need a champion to represent the consumer and to protect us from the shareholder profiteers who don't give a damn about the cars and only care about the money.

Are you saying you don't own any shares of Ford stock? (either directly or within a mutual fund)

Or are you a surprisingly forgiving shareholder?