Oil Filter Install Question

[HighHP]

This is my first time changing oil on a 2005 GT, using a Ford Motorcraft FL-2024 filter for the GT. I have found something odd on placement of the oil filter. The filter fits over a plastic sleeve that fits into the filter screw on cover. The filter seals on the sleeve on the cover end. On the lower end, the filter fits up against a cone for a seal. I put the filter in the engine side canister and then screwed on the cap with the sleeve installed in the cap. Doing this, pushed the filter tight against the cone and onto the sleeve. I then removed the cap, sleeve and filter. See pic for how far the filter was pushed onto the sleeve. There is a 1/4 inch gap between the flange of the sleeve and the filter. When I took the old filter out, the filter was pushed fully against the sleeve flange. I assume the person that last changed the oil, pushed the filter fully against the sleeve flange, which seems to be the correct action. This means that there was a 1/4 inch gap between the filter and the cone. In this position, oil will by-pass the filter thru the 1/4 inch gap.

Does anyone know what is happening here?

 

[Art138]

At the end of where the paper filter sits you should see a rubber o ring. Check to determine if it is seated properly. It could have been dislodged upward preventing the filter to seat properly.

 

[Sinovac]

Install the oil filter over the insert in the cap first. When you install it into the housing, everything will be in proper position.

 

[nota4re]

The correct procedure is to take the cap assembly as shown in the picture that Art posted and place it on a bench. Slide the new filter over that round plastic cage. Now, press down on the newly installed filter until it "snaps" into place. It takes a little bit of force, but it will snap in. Don't forget to replace the outer o-ring and make sure it is lubricated with fresh oil.

Side note: This entire assembly is from BMW and if you should ever need a new one, it is MUCH cheaper to acquire it as a BMW part!

 

[HighHP]

That is what I assumed for filter install. The two o-rings on the bayonet end part of the sleeve/cage are properly installed. However, when installed in the canister with the filter pushed all the way on the sleeve/cage, there is a 1/4" gap on the bottom side of the filter. This means oil can pass thru the gap and by-pass the filter. It does not seal on anything. The sleeve/cage would have to snap down out of the cap 1/4" before the bottom of the filter contacts the cone in the canister bottom. When I first removed the cap, the sleeve/cage and filter remained in the canister, this means that the sleeve/cage did snap out of the cap.
Does everyone have the filter and sleeve/cap remain in the canister when the cap is removed or do they sometimes come out attached to the cap?

 

[nota4re]

In your picture in Post 1 of this thread, the oil filter is NOT installed correctly. It will need to "snap" down over that last 1/4" section. Place that assembly as is back into the cap, the press down on the filter and it will snap into place.

90% of the time, the filter and assembly will come out in the cap.

 

[Specracer]

And you can also buy the Mann filters vs motorcraft, and use them in your "3 series" also (we have a 3 series that uses the same filter)

and if you should ever need a new one, it is MUCH cheaper to acquire it as a BMW part!

 

[HighHP]

Thanks for the BMW recommendations. I found a post from the past that showed the BMW exploded view with BMW part numbers. Just ordered a spare cap which includes the cage and the two bayonet o-rings for $33, filter set $10, 4 additional bayonet o-rings $2.50 each. All BMW parts from BMW dealer. After market price was no less $$$$. EBay was, but.......... I assume all this is manuf by Mann, they seem to make hydraulic filter, cooler assemblies.

See attached diagrams, then read below.

Sorry to keep on this, but here I go. The picture in my first post showed where the filter fits the cage when the filter is against the canister bottom, with the cap and cage fully installed. Imagine that the filter, cage and cap are installed as in my first post picture. Then if you could reach inside and slide the filter up to the cage base, the 1/4' gap will now exist between the filter base and the canister bottom. This gap will provide a by-pass gap for the oil to flow through. Think about it. Thoughts?????

 

[nota4re]

So, your conclusion is that there's 4,000+ GT's running around with an engineering defect that allows oil not to be filtered... and you just discovered it?

Do you have the right filter? (My assumption is yes...)

My experience differs than yours.... If you install the filter as in your picture in Post 1, it is VERY hard to get the cap threads to engage. Back in 2006, I actually struggled with this on the first couple of oil changes we performed... why is it so $%^% hard to re-engage the threads? The reason is that the assembly is too long until the oil filter is fully seated - touching on both ends, and preventing you from getting the threads engaged. Then, when you do engage them, the threading of the cap is actually pressing the filter over this last 1/4" gap. It is much easied to snap the filter in place - which enables the threads to engage. In short, I disagree with your asserting that there is a "gap".

 

[Specracer]

Ha ha ha, I remember doing that... also around that time frame. .

, it is VERY hard to get the cap threads to engage. Back in 2006, I actually struggled with this on the first couple of oil changes we performed... why is it so $%^% hard to re-engage the threads?

 

[HighHP]

Ok, went back and re-inspected after much appreciated comments. Now I get to grovel a bit, before explaining what was actually happening. With an aircraft mechanics background my detailed habits continue - everything gets closely inspected new and old until one feels satisfied with the install. There have been aircraft engine failures, crashes and deaths due to installation of improperly inspected new faulty parts. There was no way I was going to install that filter on my GT when things looked amiss. I did not know if, I was doing it wrong, parts were wrong, parts were missing, etc. The Ford service manual simply said "install filter", but which f**** way.

I again installed the filter as noted above, each time the same 1/4" gap appeared. However, I did notice some different friction this time at the end of tightening the cap. After further inspection, I noticed that the filter bottoms against the cap base not the cage when installed. So I took out the cage and installed the filter with only the cap. The cap did indeed feel tight at the last bit of tightening. I also added some marking compound (grease) to the canister bottom and mandrel. When I took off the cap. The filter was tightly pressed over the mandrel to almost the canister bottom. Perfect fit no gap!!!!! So what was happening before is that the tight fit on the bottom would pull the filter off the cage 1/4" each time before releasing on the bottom mandrel. So now, I can install the filter and cap, YAY. And it can go in either way, filter in canister, or filter on cage. However, as mentioned by others, filter in cage is much easier.

Sorry, to have taken your time, but you did provide me with the info to source BMW oil filter parts and to figure out that all my filter parts were correct.

Thanks a lot, much appreciated. 'til next over thinked issue.

 

[twobjshelbys]

I've found after 60 or so years of working on all things that when putting something back together for the first time the key is to know what it looked like before taking it apart. cell phone cameras are great for the before part

 

[AJK]

That is what I assumed for filter install. The two o-rings on the bayonet end part of the sleeve/cage are properly installed. However, when installed in the canister with the filter pushed all the way on the sleeve/cage, there is a 1/4" gap on the bottom side of the filter. This means oil can pass thru the gap and by-pass the filter. It does not seal on anything. The sleeve/cage would have to snap down out of the cap 1/4" before the bottom of the filter contacts the cone in the canister bottom. When I first removed the cap, the sleeve/cage and filter remained in the canister, this means that the sleeve/cage did snap out of the cap.
Does everyone have the filter and sleeve/cap remain in the canister when the cap is removed or do they sometimes come out attached to the cap?

06 late production GT. My bayonet only has one o-ring, not two like my fathers 3 series BMW. Anyone else just have one?

AJK

 

[HighHP]

06 late production GT. My bayonet only has one o-ring, not two like my fathers 3 series BMW. Anyone else just have one?

Interesting. On the second post Art138 mentions the o-ring, like only 1. Upon close inspection of the Ford service manual, the drawing shows only one in the slot closest to the filter. Mine has a green o-ring closest to the filter, and a black slightly smaller one on the end slot. When I placed the bayonet in the drain hole the black one did not seem to be snug, the green one was as expected. Apparently, someone added the black one. The slot near the end of the bayonet has a smaller diameter than the one closer to the filter. I suspect the slot near the end of the bayonet is not supposed to have an o-ring. I was going to check the diameters of both slots in the BMW bayonet when it arrives. I bet they are the same. The BMW parts drawing does show the same o-ring in each slot. I will be closely comparing my current ford cage and cap to the BMW parts. Googling Mann; Mann seems to be a German company big into hydraulic filter/cooler assemblies. The BMW and GT filter assemblies do look the same in the drawings.

 

[AJK]

Interesting. On the second post Art138 mentions the o-ring, like only 1. Upon close inspection of the Ford service manual, the drawing shows only one in the slot closest to the filter. Mine has a green o-ring closest to the filter, and a black slightly smaller one on the end slot. When I placed the bayonet in the drain hole the black one did not seem to be snug, the green one was as expected. Apparently, someone added the black one. The slot near the end of the bayonet has a smaller diameter than the one closer to the filter. I suspect the slot near the end of the bayonet is not supposed to have an o-ring. I was going to check the diameters of both slots in the BMW bayonet when it arrives. I bet they are the same. The BMW parts drawing does show the same o-ring in each slot. I will be closely comparing my current ford cage and cap to the BMW parts. Googling Mann; Mann seems to be a German company big into hydraulic filter/cooler assemblies. The BMW and GT filter assemblies do look the same in the drawings.

I may have missed the smaller black one but there definitely is only one green one. My fathers BMW definitely has two green ones.

AJK

 

[Indy GT]

Side note: This entire assembly is from BMW and if you should ever need a new one, it is MUCH cheaper to acquire it as a BMW part!

New owners with questions, just install as Nota4re explains. Alternate (cheaper and identical to Ford) filter is Mann HU 925/4.